Chat & Social > The Bar - General Chat
A crushing blow
Terminus:
I realise it seems harsh but the police have to obey the law and if it seems sometimes that the end result is harsh - I appologise but it's not like they have a choice and often (as i believe in this case) the fact that someone has broken the law is overlooked or perhaps the seriousnes is not appreciated.
I'm not trying to make people think as I do I'm just tying to put across a point of view that may not have been considered.
I'm also not asking everyone to agreee with me
Bob696:
--- Quote ---Comparisons with Nazi Germany may sound over the top but when you start to allow the Police to punish people without them having the chance to defend themselves in court it is the start of a slippery slope toward a fascist state.
--- End quote ---
Replace fascist with totalitarian and you are nearer the mark.
I find it sickening that anybody can be punished without due recourse to law. I would have no problem with the bike being crushed if a court (with proper legal representation for all parties) decided that was the way to go. There is something very wrong when an individual can decide to punish another individual jsut because they have the power to do so.
I have read and considered the comments concerning the chain of command i.e. the decision goes to the sargent then the inspector etc and to be honest I think that is no protection at all. A sargent will be inclined to back up the PC, an inspector to back up his sargent etc and so the process is NOT impartial and is based on on guilty until someone in the chain is in a very good mood.
Also the comment that traffic law was set in stone (sorry but I may be takeing the comment out of context to prove a point) rather goes to proove a point. How many people have been "let off" for a minor infringment? Isnt this an example of how police officers are individuals and should therefor not be allowed to be the "jury". Just imagine if this law was expanded just a little and you encountered a PC who was on the RA exec :?
This sort of thing has always been a bug bear of mine especialy as regards HMC&E who have way more power of "on the spot" punishment than the police could dream of.
Skibum346:
--- Quote from: "att" ---The Police do not make the right decision everytime, much like Judges.
No one is perfect.
In my opinion, police should not have the right to make these decisions, as councils should not either, they have been given too much power over the average citizen.....Even to the point that councils can seize an empty property after six months, with no right of appeal.
The UK has become fascist, it is a fact.
We will all be chipped soon, the next 10 - 20 years, they will use crime as an excuse, they are already monitoring our vehicles, it will be us next.
We are slowly but surely being led by the nose to constant monitoring, they are clever in their psychological conditioning as they do it.
People are mostly weak and ignorant to this, they see these measures as salvation to the anti-social climate and crime ridden society and take on board the "what have you got to hide" mentality.
I have my indivduality to hide, my inner self etc......My creative self, my innovative self, I just want to be me and hide away when needs be and be a social chamelion when needs be, I don`t want to be demographed, pigeon holed, labelled, homogonised, pastuerised, standardised for the sake of the Govt. and large Corps.
I want to be free.
--- End quote ---
Fascism: Definition from Wikipedia:
Fascism is a radical totalitarian political philosophy that combines elements of corporatism, authoritarianism, extreme nationalism, militarism, anti-anarchism, anti-communism and anti-liberalism.
The original fascist (fascismo) movement ruled Italy from 1922 to 1943 under the leadership of Benito Mussolini. In time, the generic term fascism came to cover a class of authoritarian political ideologies, parties, and political systems, most notably Nazi Germany under Adolf Hitler but also Hungary's Arrow Cross Party, Romania's Iron Guard, Spain's Falange and the French political movements led by former socialists Marcel Déat and Jacques Doriot and others.
Yeah... your right enough.... we are a fascist state........ :roll:
Terminus:
--- Quote from: "Bob696" ---I have read and considered the comments concerning the chain of command i.e. the decision goes to the sargent then the inspector etc and to be honest I think that is no protection at all. A sargent will be inclined to back up the PC, an inspector to back up his sargent etc and so the process is NOT impartial and is based on on guilty until someone in the chain is in a very good mood.
--- End quote ---
On the basis of that surely the judge could do the same .... if you think todays police are there to just blindly back each other up for the fun of it - perhaps you should sign on the line and try it - I suspect you'd find it a totally different world - nothing happens without evidence not even the crushing of a bike. Bad day or not.
Bob696:
--- Quote ---On the basis of that surely the judge could do the same
--- End quote ---
Indeed you could BUT there are legal safeguards such as having a barrister there acting on your behalf, a jury, legal clarks to advise, appeals procedure etc etc. Not to mention the CPS at the fist instance.
Backing up "your own" is just human nature, please dont try to tell us that it dosnt happen. It might even be rare BUT once (to the detriment of an individual) is too many times.
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