Fuel protest is back

[Bob696]

http://www.transaction-2007.com/phpBB2/index.php

Taken from a Land Rover forum

Hi everyone. Despite my motive for posting here, I must add I am a Land Rover enthusiast to. I own a new Range Rover 4.4 Vogue and love it to bits.

My point in posting here is to draw your attention to a more serious matter...Fuel Prices!

I am a head player in the Transaction Group, you may remember we brought the Government around to our way of thinking back in 2000 when we blockaded all the refineries. Our aim has always been to get cheaper fuel for everyone, not just transport (despite being Transport orientated).

If you want to join us in an imminent fuel protest, bigger, better and far more explosive than in 200, please log on to transaction-2007.com and register your votes of approval or disapproval (we listen to everyones opinions) and tell us what you think of this crazy fuel tax problem that is now out of control in the UK. Pledge your support and join us in protest.

Best Wishes Chris H (Transaction-2007.com)

[Thrasher]

Best get some popcorn and get ready to work from home. It's going to be fun watching marshall law on TV ;-)

[Evilgoat]

I backed the last one, and I'm really not sure this one is a good idea.

Playing for higher stakes as it were this time around.

[Thrasher]

The blockades will affect the country. Business *WILL* suffer.

Can't see who it will help in the long run. We can't hold the government to ransom, it DOES NOT WORK. All they might do is knock a few pence off, and then shove it on something else in March. False economy :(

After seeing Gordon Brown in action, I'm not sure he'd give in  :shock:

[denviks]

so what is the answer????


do you continue to pay higher prices until its only the very elite that can afford to run a vehicle....


or do you say something now??


i honestly dont know the answer...( wish i did )... but when you look across the water and see them paying so little for thier fuel then it does grate a bit  :(

[Evilgoat]

The blockades will affect the country. Business *WILL* suffer.

Can't see who it will help in the long run. We can't hold the government to ransom, it DOES NOT WORK. All they might do is knock a few pence off, and then shove it on something else in March. False economy :(

After seeing Gordon Brown in action, I'm not sure he'd give in  :shock:

He cant afford to. As I said in the other thread. Fuel isnt the big issue it was, there are more pressing ones, Immigration, Housing issues, Council taxes.

If he backs down on a littl epoint like fuel there WILL be mass protests for the above too, then it'll get nasty.

IMHO the government is holding things together, but only just, there are so many potential ignition points right now and they arent stupid, theres a lot of firefighting going on and I cant see them declaring open season by backing down. I dont know how far the Ill will towards our government goes but I suspect there is a fair amount right now, so its imperitive they deal with anything like thisk quickly and cleanly or it will all go pear shaped.

[Thrasher]

but when you look across the water and see them paying so little for thier fuel then it does grate a bit

I thought we'd sorted that issue. See other thread  

[Drift]

Lets roll over and let the goverment tickle our belly  


Free country,Democracy, I really wonder if we are tied up and gagged in the political sence.

We need an alternitive party, but that will be dozens of years away.

[littlepow]

Maybe the focus of the complaints towards fuel pricing, should be more to improving public transport. Then more people could reduce the usage of their vehicles.

But unfortunately the only answer is more economical vehicles. Leaving the less economical as second vehicles for pleasure use.

[dazzawhipple]

Its Exspensive here $1.28 per litre :shock:

[littlepow]

Fuel is expensive in most European countries these days.

But then look at what the government provides to the public for free.

You will usually find that the contries with lower taxation provide less services.

So the question is what services do you want to give up, just to get cheaper fuel?

[Evilgoat]

Fuel is expensive in most European countries these days.

But then look at what the government provides to the public for free.

You will usually find that the contries with lower taxation provide less services.

So the question is what services do you want to give up, just to get cheaper fuel?

I'm not sure thats true.

Working in Soton and living in Portsmouth I have the choice
£5 ish for train, plus 2 mile walk each end and inconvienent arrive/depart times adding almost 2 hours to my working day.

£5 by bus + £1.25 to get a bus to Central Portsmouth and £0.75 this end from Soton to Hamble + 2 hours again. And the times are awful.

£4ish for the car and I get here when I want, leave when I want.

In Calgary:
From Acadia to Downtown (8 miles)
Drive, $2/3 of fuel. $10 of parking assuming I find a spot/reserve one.
Train/Bus, 2 min walk, $2 for all day travel anywhere, bus gets in 2 mins before train leaves, train right to downtown about 1 block from where I worked. Busses and trains run at sensible times.

Alberta has NO GST (about half of our VAT bill here gone)
Taxes are lower than here in terms of income tax
No NI, although you do have healthcare but thats still half of NI

This scene is repeated all over the world. Seattle, Vancouver, NYC, San-Fran, etc all the same sort of setup.

Here we seem to think that pricing people onto useless public transport will work while the infrastructure remains broken. We seem to have missed the fact that if these services work, people WILL use them. I would. Much rather sit in a warm train and read then get wound up on the M27.

[Drift]

I work in the local head office for one of the UK and Europes biggest public transport operators and believe me at least on the bus side of things the goverment NEED to get there finger out.

This is a personal opinion.

Public transport still have to pay for fuel.
It is not subsidided anywhere close to the level people think, 90% is purely commercial.
Would you sell something that costs you money to sell?

Bus companies cant run routes that cost them money either, or they wouldnt exist.

[lambert]

There is a way to avoid this. Abandon road fund licence. That way we get a tax break and they still get more money out of them as use more fuel. Much fairer.

[Drift]

There is a way to avoid this. Abandon road fund licence. That way we get a tax break and they still get more money out of them as use more fuel. Much fairer.

The greenies would be on your back then  :(  using fuel killing the world ect ect ect  :roll:

[lambert]

But for the fact that a tree hugging hippie who has a diet mostly comprising of lentils and cabbage will produce more green house gas from their rs than my car does. :twisted:  :D

[littlepow]

In Calgary:
From Acadia to Downtown (8 miles)
Drive, $2/3 of fuel. $10 of parking assuming I find a spot/reserve one.
Train/Bus, 2 min walk, $2 for all day travel anywhere, bus gets in 2 mins before train leaves, train right to downtown about 1 block from where I worked. Busses and trains run at sensible times.

Alberta has NO GST (about half of our VAT bill here gone)
Taxes are lower than here in terms of income tax
No NI, although you do have healthcare but thats still half of NI

This scene is repeated all over the world. Seattle, Vancouver, NYC, San-Fran, etc all the same sort of setup.

But America and Canada don't provide the same level of free health care. Health insurances don't cover major long term illness, so families pick up the tab.
This is there pay off for the lower taxes.

There is a way to avoid this. Abandon road fund licence. That way we get a tax break and they still get more money out of them as use more fuel. Much fairer.

Ok you scrap a tax revenue, so what services are you going to cut to cover the losses, or what are you going to tax more?

At the end of the day, do you want to pay a £1 a litre for fuel to use a luxury (which is what cars are) or £60 to see a doctor every time your ill and be charged the full costs of the medications and vaccinations?

[cardiff_gareth]

I work in an area where no public transport goes to so I HAVE to use my Disco every day.

[fudge]

At the end of the day, do you want to pay a £1 a litre for fuel to use a luxury (which is what cars are) or £60 to see a doctor every time your ill and be charged the full costs of the medications and vaccinations?

Not all cars are luxuries...... but your point is valid!

[littlepow]

I work in an area where no public transport goes to so I HAVE to use my Disco every day.

But there are exceptions, unfortunately they will always suffer for it. But fo rthe majority, how many use the car for convenience rather than cycle or walk?

I live in an area with no public transport, but I don't use my car everyweek. I have never really used  motorised vehicles to get round unless the distance is to great. Would rather walk or cycle, but that just might be me being a tight Yorkshireman.

[mike142sl]

so what is the answer????

Probably home brew. Am I right in thinking you can make 2500 litres of biodiesel before being taxed now. If you do 25mpg thats about 13,000 miles a year at about 10p per litre if you can find a chippie to give you their used oil, or 40p per litre if you buy it straight.
I only do about 5-6K per year so it's probably not worth investing in a kit as there are a couple of outlets in Sheffield now, but they start at about £1k for a basic one.

[mike142sl]

I work in an area where no public transport goes to so I HAVE to use my Disco every day.

If it's just to get to work get a larger moped like a 125cc - £15 road tax and 70mpg. Less depreciation on the Disco, more fun to be had with it.

[cardiff_gareth]

I work in an area where no public transport goes to so I HAVE to use my Disco every day.

If it's just to get to work get a larger moped like a 125cc - £15 road tax and 70mpg. Less depreciation on the Disco, more fun to be had with it.

SWMBO won't let me, after having a few accidents she thinks I'll do myself in so I've been banned from 2 wheels  :lol:  :lol:

[lambert]

You say something has to give.

At the moment we have one of the highest tax burdens our country has ever seen. And yet our health, education armed and social services are at an all time low.

Why?
 
I could point the blame at all sorts of things like a non contributing population rise. But i wont in case i offend.
 
The government bang on about more efficatious use of resources but in that case where is all the tax revenue going if it is all so efficient?

[denviks]

You say something has to give.

At the moment we have one of the highest tax burdens our country has ever seen. And yet our health, education armed and social services are at an all time low.

Why?
 
I could point the blame at all sorts of things like a non contributing population rise. But i wont in case i offend.
 
The government bang on about more efficatious use of resources but in that case where is all the tax revenue going if it is all so efficient?

amen mate............. im with you on that

[Sider]

You ask where money could be saved. At the risk of being controversial, and maybe even banned, I shall give you an example of how to save money.

Not long ago, while helping a friend of mine to sort out his parents disability benefits (father worked all his life, degenerative arthritis, can hardly walk, mother 90% loss of sight) and hitting the proverbial wall at every stage... We witnessed a gentleman from certain eastern country pull into the council offices, jump the queue, and kick up a fuss because the benefit money would not give him enough to support his 2 wifes and 6 kids back at home. Funny enough, the same helpful council worker who had been sending us around in circles all day could be seen losing his derriere to help said gentleman.

Now, the gentleman is known to us, he does not work, he has wife and 5 kids in this country, none of whom work, and drives an '06 E class merc. And he still has the guts to claim money to support another 2 wifes (last I checked, bigamy was still a criminal offence in the British legal system), and what's even worse, the same useless git who has been stalling you all day turns into efficiency in person to help the poor old lad.

That would be one way of saving money. By stopping benefits to people like that. Continue by stopping unemployment benefits to those idiots who do not want to work, and who knows, maybe you'll find yourself with some money in the pot that will allow you to give a few more pence to those who really need it, and yet have enopugh so you can cut on taxes.

BTW, if you ever go to Madrid, have a look at the public transport system. £25/month will buy you unlimited travel through the city centre, £50 will do the same, but throughout the county.

[Drift]

BTW, if you ever go to Madrid, have a look at the public transport system. £25/month will buy you unlimited travel through the city centre, £50 will do the same, but throughout the county

We run buses there  :oops:
Can get you a Liverpool area ticket for £44 for 28 days    

I agree in princible to what your saying though.

[datalas]

In the interests of free speech [1] I have (so far) chosen not to moderate any of the posts in this conversation, however I do feel that we are skating dangerously close to a line of what is considered accurate, tasteful and "proper".

I would politely ask that we all take a step backwards and possibly a deep breath before we comment any further....

Or, to put it another way... "please don't make me lock this thread", and really, really don't make me ban anyone.


[1] I once heard the comment that the freedom of speech wasn't actually the foremost right of an individual, and was actually second only to the freedom to not listen.  Advise I feel could be useful in not getting irritated by opinions which may differ from yours :)

[Wolfie]

I'm not looking forward to dry pumps. I guess the protestors havent given any thought to people that are completely dependant on pupm fuel for basics (at least they are probably considered basic in this country and time) of living such as electricity and hot water. Hopefully I'll be able to get out to get some more coal when I need it.

[Lord Shagg-Pyle]

Bring it on. If I can't get to work because I have no fuel, then whose problem is that? Certainly not mine. If my boss starts to say "All officers have to keeptheir cars full up,I'll send him the bill.