Starting Problem & Alternator Wiring - URGENT!!

[TechnoTurkey]

Always the case, taking the Range + 4 other people and a caravan to V festival this weekend, do a final oil water check etc tonight and then the thing starts playing up.

When trying to start it, the starter does not turn and the solenoid under the bonnet goes like a machine gun, I am hoping this is just a low battery and that a good charge over night will sort - any comments??  I tried to jump start it and it made no difference, although this was off a tiny battery on a Honda Jazz!  If I can't get the Range going for Thursday night I am in big trouble!

The second problem, which may not be a problem and has probably always being like it - unless it is the cause of my flat battery, is that there is a brown wire hanging loose by the alternator.  I couldn't see anywhere obvious that it came from, nor are there any warning lights on the dash.  Any thoughts?  It seems to come from the loom with the white cable to the alternator.

Would really appreciate any help that anyone can offer, even if just to put my mind at rest!

[tack43]

Is it a thick brown wire. If so it should be connected to one of the large teminals coming out of thr alternator and is proberbly why the battery's not charging.

[TechnoTurkey]

It's just a thin one, pic now attached.....

[tack43]

It's connected to a stud between the thick brown wire and where the white wires plug in. Just looked at mine!

[TechnoTurkey]

Thanks, suspect the stud has worked totally loose in that case. Should be able to fix tomorrow.

And the machine gun noise?   Really hope that is just battery related.....

[tack43]

Sounds like the noise the solenoid would make if battery was almost flat. See what it's like after a charge up.  ;)

[clbarclay]

If it still clicks like that after a chage then it could be that you also have a bad connection from the battery to the starter motor, its usually the earth starps that can suffer.

[TechnoTurkey]

Thanks everyone, I'll have a look straight after work tomorrow and pray its sortable!

[Range Rover Blues]

The brown wire might be the field wire for the alternaotr, without it connected it's possible the alternaotr never got excited and hasn't been charging.

Did the dash board woaring light work properly? did the rev counter work (IIRC that;s the thinnest wire on the alt, the white one).

[TechnoTurkey]

No warning lights on the dash and the rev counter has been working.

[squaddie_fox]

did you try just skipping the solenoid altogether and putting a screw driver across the terminals? had this problem on my foden. solenoid was knackered but worked on the odd occasion.

[TechnoTurkey]

Right, it wasn't starting as the starter had shattered!  Now need a new one today!!  Might have to buy a brand spanker! :twisted:

[TechnoTurkey]

Picture of the damaged starter:



It looked pretty new so could have been a poor quality pattern part?

Very very fortunately I managed to fish the broken bit out of the bell housing by poking a ruler through the starter aperture and removing the little plate at the bottom of the bell housing, it just fit through this gap and appeared to be a clean break.  God knows how much trouble I would have been in if I couldn't get it out!

[squaddie_fox]

that looks lovely and new, see if you can find a receipt for it. got to be some form of guarantee on it. then you may be able to get a refund, or at least replacement part/store credit..............worth a try??? :-k

[Rossko]

By the by, the thin brown wire is the remote voltage sensing for the alternator regulator.   In this design, the regulator doesn't look at its own output, it looks at the actual battery terminal voltage which is fed to it via the thin wire.   This avoids any small voltage drops in the heavy current-carrying cable.

Sometimes the alternator will have been replaced by an alternate type with only inbuilt voltage sensing, in which case there's nowhere to fit the wire and it can be left off.  But insulated cos its battery live!!

cheers, Ross K