Mud-club
Vehicle & Technical => Discovery => Topic started by: PUX on December 29, 2005, 12:24:38
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Guys went out yesterday for a play with roger and had a couple of scares :lol: :lol: now im just getting to grips with diffrent suspension set ups and i have been told if i take me arbs off then this will give me more articalation (spelling) is this true and how bad will it be on the road i also already have dislocation cones any help appreciated :D oh does any one know wot the tilt angle is on the disco i have looked but cant find or im being blind lol cheers
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*can of worms, opened, worms everywhere*
I'm watching this thread with interest.
:lol:
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*can of worms, opened, worms everywhere*
I'm watching this thread with interest.
:lol:
ops im sorry :twisted: :twisted: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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sorry also forgot to metion the reason for this idea above is that at this point and time i cant afford to start getting a better suspension set up cheers guys
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Dislocation cones, and now considering taking the anti roll bars off.
GOOD MAN
Thought Id jump in with my 2 cents worth, Bin the arb's, enjoy the articulation, but beware, the vehicle will feel....different.....on the road, take time to learn how she feels, or fabricate some way of disconnecting/reconnecting them arb's.
Rollazuki :wink:
Ps disregard any information further on in this thread about not needing articulation/suspension/springs etc........... :lol:
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Ask yourself a Few questions ? Do you drive fast??? Do you enter corners like theres no tomorrow...Or do you have a landrover built to go off roading??? By the looks of the photo you go off roading ..I have taken both mine off and i cant tell any difference. I dont gun it around in my disco because it cant!! its be built to go off road not boy race around the carparks and round-abouts..Its down to personal choice, If you want it to handle well on the road dont lift it (you have)..I have'nt built my Disco for comfort, Its built to go where a standard disco cant go..Over kerbs :P :P :P
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I have a disco 1, no roll bars fitted. I think it was only the "chelsea tractor" brigade they were fitted for anyway wernt they ?
(Oh I said chelsea tractor, I can feel the flames already)
Peter
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Peter,
The anti-roll bars were fitted to the 300 series because they realised that putting a 185bhp V8 under the bonnet, mating it to a decent gearbox and forgetting to improve handling might have been seen as a bit of a no no ;-)
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personally im going to take mine off once ive warmed up from doing rear brakes in the snow yesterday. i want the articulation off road, dont drive it fast on road or hang it into corners.
i no this is a very questionable subject, but if you dont like it you can alwyas put them back on again, im going to give it a go.
same as pux, cant afford flash suspension - yet - im saveing!
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The anti-roll bars were fitted to the 300 series because they realised that putting a 185bhp V8 under the bonnet, mating it to a decent gearbox and forgetting to improve handling might have been seen as a bit of a no no
did they only sell the V8 in Chelsea then?? ;)
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lol!
Nah, but as usual the premier vehicle in the line up got all the toys ... and then I suppose they thought that the tractor version might like some handling too ;-)
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Peter,
The anti-roll bars were fitted to the 300 series because they realised that putting a 185bhp V8 under the bonnet, mating it to a decent gearbox and forgetting to improve handling might have been seen as a bit of a no no ;-)
I stand corrected, but it would have been nice to have been flamed :twisted:
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If you build an 'offroader' then you arent wanting ultimate handling...or you owuldnt dream od fitting mt's.
So the only arb's you want are lockers.
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well guys i drive like miss daisy any how :lol: :lol: i do go off road alot and big style but it belive it or not is my everyday truck so im going to take em off for now then and see how i get on but thats after i have played in the snow yepee but any other advice is appreciated cheers guys :D
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My 1993 200tdi hasn't got ARBs and it never has had them.
Maybe the diseasel didn't warrant ARB...
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Ed ;-)
The anti-roll bars were fitted to the 300 series
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My 93 V8 has them, but after reading this tread it wont have for long.
Somthing to do tomorrow me thinks :D
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Official Government Warning :
Removing your anti-roll bars may or may not have any effect whatsoever on your vehicle's off-road performance
It will almost certainly make the vehicle roll more when driving along the road !
Take 'em off if you like, but don't expect miracles !
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Official Government Warning :
Removing your anti-roll bars may or may not have any effect whatsoever on your vehicle's off-road performance
It will almost certainly make the vehicle roll more when driving along the road !
Take 'em off if you like, but don't expect miracles !
well tim got to try these things :twisted:
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Anti roll bars, not! But like Tim says doesnt handle like a sports car.
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Well after reading the first couple of posts I've been racking my brains as to how removing locking diffs would improve articulation :oops:
Now I've read the whole thread I'll go bang mi' head on a brick wall followed by a lie down :roll:
Dave :D :D :D
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Well after reading the first couple of posts I've been racking my brains as to how removing locking diffs would improve articulation :oops:
Now I've read the whole thread I'll go bang mi' head on a brick wall followed by a lie down :roll:
Dave :D :D :D
Yes, me anall, i am rather slow on the uptake at the mo tho. Too much Xmas cheer.
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Yes, me anall, i am rather slow on the uptake at the mo tho. Too much Xmas cheer.
Thank God it's not just me then ........ true JW the Xmas cheer might have had a "slight effect"
Dave
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To add my two penneth, the RTI for a standard RRC is virtually the same with or without ARBs. Some MOT stations will not issue a pass if they have been removed. It counts as a modification that you must tell your insurance company about as it affects the handling. When you buy your lift kit, tell them you are removing the ARBs as some kits have stiffer dampers for older (non-ARB) cars.
Don't expect miracles. The cars in some of the above photo's have lots of expensive mods to allow extreme articulation.
I have 2 ARBs on the back, I like to be able to keep up with traffic, I have 2 big dogs, a b****y big trailer/caravan and an LPG tank. I like the way it handles and I'm happy with it off-highway. Put it this way, I never get stuck due to lack of articulation.
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RRb, i know what you are saying and yes there has beena few quid spent on my disco....the zuki is another story altogether. There are a few places i know of where you would be stuck with a 2 wheels waggling in the air, without lockers you would be going nowhere.
Driving skill is often the solution to most problems and with forethought and planning you dont need lots of travel often obsticles can be avoided.
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Dude , the RTI for a landy is the same with/without an arb cos as standard it has very little articulation, however, free some more articulation up with longer shocks and lift kits etc and the arb needs to come off......
Just as an interesting side thread, Its all OK to say its illegal/unMOTable/uninsurable etc if you remove the arb's, but assuming you buy a 2nd hand disco(thats already had em removed) how would you ever know, how would the insurance ever find out(assesors that come to my place of work wouldnt know an arb from an octopus).
Theres a lot of used cars driving around with bits missing, non genuine parts fitted, botched repairs, in my mind, a car owned by an enthusiast, driven with care, with known modifications fitted is a lot safer than many used cars I see(especially taxis....dont get me going)
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Guys thanks for all ur help im going to take me anti roll bars off to give it a go as i have said mine is a very modded disco for off road yes it does get used on road every day but me being me i drive like miss daisy anyhow :lol: :lol: i have done certain driving courses through my job where i can safely say i can handle most cars at speed or slowness, anyhow like i said i have a 3'lift extended brake lines and dis cones and with out wacking some more money at it this has to be a good route for seeing wot i can get some, times u just have to try for ya self :wink: :wink: :D
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Pux,
with your 3'lift extended brake lines and dis cones Have you changed your Props, Radius arms or trailing arms :?:
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When I put the caster correction radius arms on the the front of mine I had to remove the front ARB cos' it was touching the propshaft on level ground. The rear I took off at the same time as the balljoints needed replacing and, with a 3" lift, the ARB needed spacing.
I did notice a little more roll when cornering but that was sorted when I fitted the twin rear shocks. :wink:
Like RRB says, the suspension on my Disco is greatly uprated from the standard setup with +3" H/D springs and 6 ProComp ES9000 gas shocks. My insurance has a FULL list of all the mods to the vehicle, including photos & video of them all. :D (Well, they asked "a photo" to show all the mods and I couldn't fit all my mods into one photo could I!! :wink: )
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Just as an interesting side thread, Its all OK to say its illegal/unMOTable/uninsurable etc if you remove the arb's, but assuming you buy a 2nd hand disco(thats already had em removed) how would you ever know, how would the insurance ever find out(assesors that come to my place of work wouldnt know an arb from an octopus).
Ignorance is, I'm afraid, no defence. As for insurance assesors, read "loss adjusters", glorified accountants most of them.
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Dude , the RTI for a landy is the same with/without an arb cos as standard it has very little articulation,
Really?
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Really?
Looking at that as an example,
Yes really.
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Really?
Looking at that as an example,
Yes really.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Well we don't all need to be able to stick our back axle behind our head and kiss our a** goodbye as well roll quietly into a ditch. The RTI for a Range Rover is one of the highest in it's class and only bettered by the 90. The articulation is not the limiting factor, it's ground clearance (and I don't mean prunung trees)
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every aspect of your chosen vehicles performance is a limiting factor. Articulation, ground clearance, power are all factors that come into play at one time or another.
I would put mine against most out there for articulation but Rolla's zuki is better than mine - you should have a look at it, he works in Sheff. It is 1 of a kind and very ,very capable.
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I would put mine against most out there for articulation but Rolla's zuki is better than mine - you should have a look at it, he works in Sheff. It is 1 of a kind and very ,very capable.
I must be missing something here Bully, I don't doubt that Zuki has a very capable vehicle, but I thought he was talking about articulation with standard suspension?
If you want to base it on uprated/modified with no expence spared then the sky's the limit. :wink:
Me, I happy with what I've got and I don't think it's too bad considering they are 33" tyres. :wink:
(http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/landrovers/005.jpg)
If someone's something better then good luck to them and I hope they enjoy using the benifits of it. :wink:
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wow wow wow guys chill i have just a 3'lift with shocks and springs and also exteneded brake lines i was merely asking if i took the arbs of would it give me that little extra cheers for all the help
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*can of worms, opened, worms everywhere*
I'm watching this thread with interest.
:lol:
jake wot have i done :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Hey none of the argument this time has been about (whisper) Dislocation cones.
That's usually where we all get heated :lol:
Me, I've got relocation cones fitted :)
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Guys went out yesterday for a play with roger and had a couple of scares :lol: :lol: now im just getting to grips with diffrent suspension set ups and i have been told if i take me arbs off then this will give me more articalation (spelling) is this true and how bad will it be on the road i also already have dislocation cones any help appreciated :D oh does any one know wot the tilt angle is on the disco i have looked but cant find or im being blind lol cheers
Budgie , sorry but its you thats missed the point. Yes the thread has woven here and there.Pux's suspension is in no way standard. Pux wanted to know if removing his Anti roll bars would increase his articulation. He has a 3 inch lift longer lines and cones on it. The thread was then somewhat hijacked as we all know the answer is YES - taking them off will allow more movement from the axle(at 3 inch lift you also run the rick of the arb inverting- which would be fun!).
The hijacked thread then began a discussion as to whether you NEED to take them off to have a capable offroader - the answer to that is NO you dont. If you want a very capable offroader then taking off an item designed specifically to limit axle movement becomes necessary at the expense of onroad manners.
Nice piccy by the way good travel ...has it got anti roll bars fitted?
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dont get started on that one!
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cheers bulli :D
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:D simple answer to simple question is yes it will give you better articulation if removed :D
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Someone following me on a greenlane once mentioned that they could actually see that the rear anti-roll bar was restricting my articulation on a particularly tricky point. But it didn't really matter at the time. I removed it and didn't notice any significant differance on the Road, Although My Springs are Heavy Duty OME's.
Its back on now as It failed an MOT six months later because of it. The Tester could see the brackets where it had been and unfortunately has had a few Discoverys himself. Showed me the actual wording in the MOT Handbook. and yes, It looks like its a failure .
If you do remove it make sure you don't bin it like I did.
Jubby
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na i wont bin em i have a special place for landy bits all over the house the swmbo loves it :roll: :wink:
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cones?
did somebody say cones??
:shock: oh dear
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chuggaman dont even say that word please it will be like world war 3 ere then :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: ccccccc CONES (ops sorry slipped out ) :twisted:
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mine went through mot without both sets on :D :D
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CONES!
those things that dont provide traction eh!
errr whoops , what have i said?
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Budgie , sorry but its you thats missed the point.
Nice piccy by the way good travel ...has it got anti roll bars fitted?
Well, I did ask if I was missing something. :wink:
And no, I took the ARB's off when I fitted the caster correction radius arms. :D
The front's not as good but it'll do..........................for now! :wink:
(http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/landrovers/001.jpg)
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See ARB's dont help with articulation, it is true . Proof of the pudding and all that. You cant improve front articulation without some major reworking. Landrovers design is a good solution to balance on and off road performance...its just not really good at either!
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The front is easy to fix on mine, just need a pair of lowered turrets to give another two inches of travel. :wink:
Just got to get round to rebuilding the Range Rover's engine and getting it installed first. I'll get round it at some point, or I may just install a locker. :D
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Guys thank you for all ur help im gonna take the abs off and see how i get on frm there once again thank you for all ur help i wish u all a happy new year
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*can of worms, opened, worms everywhere*
I'm watching this thread with interest.
:lol:
jake wot have i done :lol: :lol: :lol:
*sits in corner laughing*
:lol: :lol:
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Budgie even with lowered turrets the front has far less travel than the back which is why they sometimes get upset on larger obsticles, the front isnt capable of articulating like the rear.
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im gonna take the abs off and see how i get on
That ain't gonna do a lot for articulation ...................... and even less for your brakes :shock:
:D :D :D
Dave
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im gonna take the abs off and see how i get on
That ain't gonna do a lot for articulation ...................... and even less for your brakes :shock:
:D :D :D
Dave
uh why will it effect the brakes ???? if its the lines then dont worrie as i have extended brake lines :?
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im gonna take the abs off and see how i get on
That ain't gonna do a lot for articulation ...................... and even less for your brakes :shock:
:D :D :D
Dave
uh why will it effect the brakes ???? if its the lines then dont worrie as i have extended brake lines :?
i think cos you said ABS and not ARB :lol:
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ops pig tits for fingers :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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well my rear one is off, front off tomorrow, then give it a go, definrtly cant notice just rear missing
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The front is easy to fix on mine, just need a pair of lowered turrets to give another two inches of travel. :wink:
I doubt you'll notice much difference. The front dampers are seldom the reason for the limits on front axle travel. Lowered turrets will only allow the axle to droop further when the whole axle is dropping out (i.e. both wheels are looking for something to touch).
The front axle struggles to articulate primarily due to the way the front radius arms attach. If anything, you may find that lowered front turrets will actually limit the articulation of the front axle by reducing the amount of bump travel you have. (Depends a lot on the body length / stroke of your dampers and your bump stop setup of course)
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Tim , you have clearly given that reply a lot of thought. Landrover front suspension is great but does reach its limits very quickly.
You dont really want the entire axle falling away as the front prop will very quickly destroy itself.
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I'm sure you'll all be pleased to know....
I'm not joining in this debate :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:
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Whats it take, an hour to pull em off(ooer)
Try it both on and off, Im sure you will notice more benefit if you have any form of lift kit on, maybe not.
I no longer need an opinion, cos You'll be able to tell by experimentation!
Ps if you leave them on you ARE wrong :lol:
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Martin,
as you,ve probably said to a member of the opposite sex in the past,......
......................GET EM OFF!!!! :lol:
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Martin,
as you,ve probably said to a member of the opposite sex in the past,......
......................GET EM OFF!!!! :lol:
yeah usaully followed by a slap :lol: :lol: :lol:
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I'm sure you'll all be pleased to know....
I'm not joining in this debate :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:
shame!
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I'm sure you'll all be pleased to know....
I'm not joining in this debate :lol: :lol: :lol: :roll:
oh go on
lol
mike
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oh dear wot did i start :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: um lets think wot else i can turn into a debate CONES (ops slip of the tounge) :twisted: :wink:
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Martin.
I took a picture of my car (SWMBO was driving it) which shows some interesting articulation.
I still have my anti roll bars with a 2" lift, 2" spacers on the bars and big bump stops + 235/85R16 tyres.
I (personally) think that without getting extreme this looks pretty wild!!
Have you took yours off?
Noticed any difference on the road?
:D
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lookin good jake i have taken the rear one of just need to do the front and have noticed a bit of diffrence but not had a chance to push it to its limits yet :twisted:
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take it to the limit and feel the difference :Dremember wheels on the ground stability and traction :D
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Martin.
I took a picture of my car (SWMBO was driving it) which shows some interesting articulation.
I still have my anti roll bars fitted with 2" spacers on the bars and big bump stops.
I (personally) think that without getting extreme this looks pretty wild!!
Have you took yours off?
Noticed any difference on the road?
:D
That's what mine would look like if I had bigger ramps to play with :roll: It's very important for the rear ARB that you fit spacers, otherwise the geometry is all wrong.