Mud-club

Vehicle & Technical => Range Rover => Topic started by: buster uk on April 01, 2007, 18:48:07

Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 01, 2007, 18:48:07
Hi guys,i was off roading today and got my rangie stuck in quite a hole.
It was full of water.Not the first time but once we got it out (4 hours later) it took a bit of starting,anyway.Drove off and after 5 mins of driving the engine rev'd up and i had no drive.Pulled over ,it would go into reverse but no forward gears.It is an automatic box.

Pics below :

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v481/busteruk/01-04-07_1219.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v481/busteruk/01-04-07_1218.jpg)

The pictures were taken when we dragged it back by Fourtrack (shush dont tell anyone !!) but couldnt get any further.The water was very deep and came over the bonnet,the exhaust was full of water.
Any ideas please,i haven't checked anything yet.
cheers
andy
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Xtremeteam on April 01, 2007, 20:00:37
sounds like the box is gimped,could have sooked water in so as a start id advise giving it an oil change but be prepared for an expensive bill,
Does the oil smell burnt or is it creamy?
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 02, 2007, 10:46:02
Not sure but i'll let you know ,im going to check it today.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 02, 2007, 12:17:27
I had exactly this problem with an old 3 speed auto box.

Off road a decent sized puddle would temporarily remove drive in gears... eventually it failed al together...

Whe I drained it though... the fluid was a lovely red colour... clean and not conatminatged looking.

I never did get to the bottom of it as the vehicle has since been scrapped.

Might not mean the box is contaminated with water though.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 02, 2007, 12:29:11
Just checked the oil.
Its a red colour but darkened not like brand new atf.But it has been in there for at least the 2.5 years i've owned it.
No filings but does smell a little burnt like brake pads or clutch.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: dave362 on April 03, 2007, 12:18:42
Well if it is a shot gear box, I have one going spare as well as many other drivetrain and engine parts after I hydraulically locked mine and bent the valves. The parts are near you in Boro so let me know if you need anything.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on April 03, 2007, 16:59:29
I can't see how that puddle would have affected the box though, unless it's something on the oil cooler.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 03, 2007, 18:11:03
Maybe it didnt and was just co-incedence,not sure.No water in the box.
Dave362,
Do you have a 4 speed for sale ? i think mines a zf 4 speed.Mines a 94 anyway.

cheers
andy
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on April 03, 2007, 18:30:17
I've got a spare box, if that's what it turns out to be.  I'm not that close though :roll:
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: dave362 on April 04, 2007, 09:13:11
Quote from: "buster uk"
Maybe it didnt and was just co-incedence,not sure.No water in the box.
Dave362,
Do you have a 4 speed for sale ? i think mines a zf 4 speed.Mines a 94 anyway.

cheers
andy


Not sure whether it is 4 speed or 5 speed. What ever was fitted to a 1987 I suppose. Feels like a 5 speed when driving it.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 04, 2007, 10:12:01
Quote from: "dave362"
Quote from: "buster uk"
Maybe it didnt and was just co-incedence,not sure.No water in the box.
Dave362,
Do you have a 4 speed for sale ? i think mines a zf 4 speed.Mines a 94 anyway.

cheers
andy


Not sure whether it is 4 speed or 5 speed. What ever was fitted to a 1987 I suppose. Feels like a 5 speed when driving it.


No such thing as a 5 speed autobox...

If it has 1-2-D... it's a Torqueflyte 3 speed

If it has 1-2-3-D ... it's a ZF 4 speed

  :wink:
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: dave362 on April 04, 2007, 10:35:23
Quote from: "Skibum346"
Quote from: "dave362"
Quote from: "buster uk"
Maybe it didnt and was just co-incedence,not sure.No water in the box.
Dave362,
Do you have a 4 speed for sale ? i think mines a zf 4 speed.Mines a 94 anyway.

cheers
andy


Not sure whether it is 4 speed or 5 speed. What ever was fitted to a 1987 I suppose. Feels like a 5 speed when driving it.


No such thing as a 5 speed autobox...

If it has 1-2-D... it's a Torqueflyte 3 speed

If it has 1-2-3-D ... it's a ZF 4 speed

  :wink:


lol, I guess it is a 4 speed then as it has d-3-2-1
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on April 04, 2007, 19:05:11
Quote from: "Skibum346"
Quote from: "dave362"
Quote from: "buster uk"
Maybe it didnt and was just co-incedence,not sure.No water in the box.
Dave362,
Do you have a 4 speed for sale ? i think mines a zf 4 speed.Mines a 94 anyway.

cheers
andy


Not sure whether it is 4 speed or 5 speed. What ever was fitted to a 1987 I suppose. Feels like a 5 speed when driving it.


No such thing as a 5 speed autobox...

If it has 1-2-D... it's a Torqueflyte 3 speed

If it has 1-2-3-D ... it's a ZF 4 speed

  :wink:


Except that the 4 speed has total lock-up at above roughly 53mph, so it give the imnpression of 5 speeds because the revs drop as the torque converter locks :wink:
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 04, 2007, 19:07:29
Quote from: "dave362"
lol, I guess it is a 4 speed then as it has d-3-2-1

 #-o

Ok.... you got me!

 :(bigoops):
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 04, 2007, 19:09:52
Quote from: "Range Rover Blues"
Except that the 4 speed has total lock-up at above roughly 53mph, so it give the imnpression of 5 speeds because the revs drop as the torque converter locks :wink:


(http://www.yodaspeak.co.uk/yoda.png)

As ever, to the superior knowledge of rrb the knower of all things I bow!  Herh herh herh.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on April 04, 2007, 19:21:28
:(biglaugh):  :(biggrin):


PMSL, thanks for that.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 04, 2007, 19:23:56
Quote from: "Range Rover Blues"
:(biglaugh):  :(biggrin):


PMSL, thanks for that.


Here... put your own words to him...!

Yoda Speak (http://www.yodaspeak.co.uk/)
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 05, 2007, 08:28:44
YODA SPEAK "My gearbox problem then any ideas on ?"
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 05, 2007, 08:48:47
Quote from: "buster uk"
YODA SPEAK "My gearbox problem then any ideas on ?"


(http://www.yodaspeak.co.uk/yoda.png)
Your gearbox may be goosed young one I think.  Always be found using the force, the solution you seek can.  Use jar jar binks as a replacement, you can. Yesssssssss.

(http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t79/Skibum346/jarjarbinksII.jpg)
Whosa...?  Meesaa?!  Wheeee...!!!!
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 05, 2007, 08:56:05
i bloody hate jar jar bloody binks !!!!
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Skibum346 on April 05, 2007, 10:51:09
:(biglaugh):  :(biglaugh):  :(biglaugh):  :(biglaugh):  :(biglaugh):
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: andycwb on April 05, 2007, 12:44:52
Use Jar-Jar for a road hump, I think.  Much better.

As to the gearbox problem, if it were me, I'd try a fluid change and if that doesn't work then I'd be looking for a replacement.  And make sure you fit breather pipes on this one!

Andy
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on April 05, 2007, 13:18:04
Quote from: "buster uk"
Just checked the oil.
Its a red colour but darkened not like brand new atf.But it has been in there for at least the 2.5 years i've owned it.
No filings but does smell a little burnt like brake pads or clutch.


That's a bad sign.  I'm not expert in Auto boxs but I think there is a clutch or brake band that does all the work going forewards, so that if it goes you can only reverse (not the first time I've heard of this happening BTW).

You could try an oil change but it will only change 2/3 of the oil as the torque converter can't be drained :roll:

Also make sure you 'purge' the valve block by selecting all the gears with the engine running.

If it works but is slipping my mate sells some fix-it-in-a-can for auto boxes, it works but doesn't do miracles.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 06, 2007, 14:22:05
ok thanks for the help.Im going to check it out today.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on April 29, 2007, 12:50:31
Hi again
Does anyone know if an 87 auto box will work on my 94 rangerover ?
Its a zf 4 speed but im unsure if the speedo cable and viscous coupling etc are the same.I read that my box has an electric sender for the speedo and earlier ones have a mechanical link.

Anyway ,will it fit ?


cheers,
andy
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on April 29, 2007, 13:31:28
The Borg-Warner and LT230 are interchangeable, so you can keep your existing T-Box and then not worry about either the viscous coupling or speedo.

But, on the soft-dash the electronic speedo sender bolts directly into the T-Box whereas on the hard-dash models there is a short cable from the T-Box to the chassis rail where the electronic sender lives.  This is partly because the very early Hot-wire cars had the old analogue speedo so the older sender had a cable drive on the front face for a second cable that ran to the dash.  By '94 this was well obsolete.

Good news is that AFAIK the electronic doobry bolts in in place of a cable, so the parts are interchangeable.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on May 07, 2007, 16:08:25
Hi again,

RangeRoverBlues,do you know if a 1997 300tdi autobox from a disco will fit ?

cheers,
andy
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on May 08, 2007, 20:50:09
I'll put money on it not fitting, the bellhousing will be different and I know that on a manual the input shaft is longer on a V8.

Plus, and this is a biggy, the valving inside will be set up for a diesel that does't do revs, so your V8 won't develop all it's power.
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on May 08, 2007, 21:13:45
Ok thanks,i'll not bother with that one,cheers

andy
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: buster uk on May 15, 2007, 09:06:50
got one at last.From a 93,and for £50  :D
Just need to fit it now  :(
Title: Auto Gearbox problem
Post by: Range Rover Blues on May 16, 2007, 12:41:31
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