Chat & Social > The Bar - General Chat
D of E
pilgrim:
--- Quote ---glad you are all safe and well but cant help thinking what a waste of valuable time for the mountian rescue
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i think that is the beauty of not only our mountain rescue services, but also the lifeboats - they are prepared to come out whatever. sure, no-one likes the really stupid call outs, but if you really are in trouble, the last thing any mountain rescue would want you to do is to hesitate whether to call them. better safe than sorry.
yes, all d of e participants should be able to read a map and compass properly before they are allowed on the hill, and they are all trained as to what to do in an emergency. but it is easy for us to say what they should have done. remember, this is a group of schoolchildren in an unfamiliar environment. i think they did the right thing - no-one got hurt, and everyone went home ok. sure, the leaders need an almighty rollocking, but the kids themselves made the right decision under the circumstances.
--- Quote ---the only way you get lost is by not using your compass and map properly
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erm ... i teach map-reading skills and have been known to "misinterpret" the map sometimes. it's not that difficult to do.
The Landy Guy:
--- Quote from: pilgrim ---
--- Quote --- but it is easy for us to say what they should have done. remember, this is a group of schoolchildren in an unfamiliar environment. i think they did the right thing - no-one got hurt, and everyone went home ok. sure, the leaders need an almighty rollocking, but the kids themselves made the right decision under the circumstances.
--- End quote ---
Thanks
--- End quote ---
Bulli:
i know map reading isnt always easy but surely the right decision would have been to stay at the bunkhouse till the morning? I know its very easy to be critical with hindsight and that wasnt and isn't my intention.
In the Uk you are never more than 70-odd miles from the coast and other than the extreme north of Scotland only a matter of miles from a road. I have walked, climbed and mountaineered for most of my life...having been past 12000 at 14. Im not the be all and end all and always take a warm bag and tent..in this country you can wait out virtually anything in safety.
anyway seems the organisers may have learnt a lesson, you should keep it up your efforts are worth it in the end.
Mountain rescue and the Lifeboat volunteers do a fantastic job and give up lots of their spare time.
Wireless:
--- Quote from: "Bulli" ---If i was your parent the D of E guy who was supposed to be running the show would be getting a bollocking, as its his responsibility to make sure you can use a map and compass.
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Actually, it's the people doing the D of E that should have responsibility for knowing how to use a map and compass, anyone over 14 should be prepared to take personal responsibility.
The D of E guy can only take the word of those undertaking D of E when they say they know what they are doing, or the word of the people that have supposedly trained them, and can only set routes to suit the level of experience. Obviously, when the mist came down the techniques required to navigate in the conditions were missing, and they got lost.
We can all be critical after the fact, but the responsibility is a joint one, bollocking someone because they have duff information on the skill levels held by individuals who have failed to consider navigation in mist as being important as a personal responsibility doesn't help in the review of the event.
Personally I wouldn't trust anyone to tell the truth about their experience, and set smaller risk assessed tasks to test the professed level of knowledge before even considering them as a candidate for an organised hike for an Award.
BTW, D of E seems to be the one everyone harps on about, even employers, but the Queen's Award is higher, the D of E rips it off.
mike142sl:
It's good Landy Guy and his mates are still up for some more, many give up after less.
Groups of this age group often get caught out in this way because they are enjoying the walk and forget to keep track of timings and landmarks, which are two main things I impress upon my Scouts. They know it takes 'about' 10 minutes to walk 1km and to adjust that for different types of terrain etc. They can then work out on the map how long it should take to reach various points or landmarks on the map. This links into keeping track of where they are at regular intervals, so even if the mist comes down they can identify footpaths that join their track, walls, woods, steams etc and work out where they are. After 26 years I've never had a group get lost using this technique - had plenty tell me they went off track for a bit, but worked out they wern't where they should have been and back tracked to find their correct route.
Let us know how you get on with your Gold Landy Guy, and have fun getting it.
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